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From: "Alice Turner" <akt@ibm.net>
Subject: (urth) Re: Digest urth.v028.n024
Date: Sun, 29 Aug 1999 21:12:42 

> Hi, I'm new. Somewhat to my surprise, the archives search engine for this
> list turns up no references to Zoroastrianism, so this may not be
> completely old ground.

Hi Jim, nice to see you.

Actually, the subject has come up, though quite a long time back. I haven't
tried the new search engine, so can't speak to that. But I know the creation
myth, and had discussed it with mantis before we two jumped on board
(another story), and I do remember that it came up here in a fairly long
thread on Dr. Talos's play.

But you do bring up interesting new matters. I had thought of the Ascians
almost entirely as Wolfe's satire of Communism or any group demanding
Correct Thought and I tend to think of Zoroastrianism as a fairly forgiving
and nonintrusive religion (I lived in Bombay for a few years during my teens
and had Parsi friends---believe me, compared to the horrors of the Hindu
caste system, Parsis, who are all sort of honorary Brahmins, have it good).
So I am a little uncomfortable with your analogy, "ironic" though it be.
How, btw, do you fit the hierodules into this design? Or don't they fit,
since they don't seem to have anything to do with the Ascians?

As to the geography question, since I disagree with just about everyone, I
won't confront that except to say that yes, they are in the southern
hemisphere (everyone will agree on that), but plate techtonics have been at
work, and no, they are not in South America (everyone will not agree on


> Then this morning, the following two things slammed into each other:
> "The most important thing about Zoroastrianism is the dedication
> to ethical and moral excellence. The motto of the faith is:
> alt.religion.zoroastrianism FAQ
> "And the Ascian, his voice no louder than my own had been, and
> perhaps even softer, answered, 'How shall the state be most
> vigorous? It shall be most vigorous when it is without conflict.
> How shall disagreement be banished? By banishing the four causes
> of disagreement: lies, foolish talk, boastful talk, and talk
> which serves only to incite quarrels. How shall the four causes
> be banished? By speaking only correct thought. Then shall the
> state be without disagreement. Being without disagrement it
> shall be without conflict. Being without conflict it shall be
> vigorous, strong and secure.'  "
> CITADEL V, last page
> It seems like it could be an ironic transformation of the Zoroastrian
> motto, a secularized heresy if you will.

*More Wolfe info & archive of this list at http://www.urth.net/urth/

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