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Date: Sat, 5 Jul 2003 01:16:02 -0700
Subject: Re: (urth) stealing apu punchau
From: Lisa Schaffer-Doggett 

On Saturday, July 5, 2003, at 12:02 AM, maa32 wrote:

> In response to Don's comments, I have a brief question about 
> synchronicity.
> So you don't think Severian is really the original Apu-Punchau?  See, 
> I always
> saw him as both the original conciliator and the original Apu-Punchau 
> (ie - if
> he didn't go back in time, those guys would never have lived).

Don replies,

	When I first read UotNS, before I read BotNS the second time and 
before delving much into Graves I did think that Severian was the 
original Conciliator and the original Apu-Punchau.  And in a sense he 
is but I think also that he isn't because as he said himself he isn't 
the first "Severian" (I put this in quotation marks because I think the 
original Severian is in fact Ymar, the name meaning ox, which also 
means Aleph, which can also mean the first or the origin but that's a 
separate argument.  One I can't resist bringing up, sort of my own 
little "Carthage must be destroyed!").  I think the original 
Conciliator and the original Apu-Punchau is the failed "Severian" 
(whoever he may be. Ymar. Ymar.) whereas our Severian is the one who 
has been modified by the Hieros to be the New Sun.  Personally, I'm 
beginning to think that It was altogether unnecessary for our Severian 
to go back in time to fulfill a role as either of these two past 
figures.  I think it may have been a fulfillment of some dark ambition 
to assume these roles, maybe to salvage something good for himself 
since his destiny seemed to be that of a tyrant and destroyer.  Even 
this doesn't seem to work out so well for him though.  But I'm slipping 
away from my point which is simply that no, I don't strictly believe 
that Severian is the original Apu-Punchau or the original Conciliator.  
I would rather say that he contains them both and then some.


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