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From: "Dan'l Danehy-Oakes" 
Subject: RE: (urth) The Saga of the Urth Mailing List: An Excerpt
Date: Tue, 11 Jun 2002 15:51:12 -0700


I suppose this is a question of interpretation... To me, the "in so
far as there is a Christ figure" seems to me to be a way of saying
that there really isn't, but if you have to find one, Severian would
be it.

> -----Original Message-----
> From: James Wynn [mailto:crushtv@HotPOP.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2002 12:25 PM
> To: urth@urth.net
> Subject: RE: (urth) The Saga of the Urth Mailing List: An Excerpt
> Ah! Yes. Here's the quote:
> JJ: The holy slaves [Heirodules], Famulimus or one of them 
> tells Severian
> that he is the center of his race, the savior of his race. 
> That is such
> Christlike language you can see why interpreters would say 
> well Severian is
> a Christ figure. But is there a Christ figure in the book, or 
> is he simply
> for this universe?
> GW: In so far as there is a Christ figure it is Severian. 
> That doesn't mean
> he has to be identified with Christ. He is in a position 
> similar to that of
> Christ. But really it is a different position because Christ 
> really is both
> God and man. Severian is not. Severian is a Christian rather 
> than a Christ.
> But he is been taken as the representative of humanity by 
> whom humanity is
> to be judged. This I think is what has happened perhaps with 
> the actual
> human Jesus. He is or was is as fully human as you or I and 
> we are saved by
> Him. By the fact that he passed. That the corruption did not 
> destroy Him. I
> think that St. Paul is absolutely correct when he says that Jesus was
> tempted in all the ways that we are tempted. I think that 
> Jesus was tempted
> to commit murder or any other sin that you want to name just 
> as the rest of
> us are. And the difference is that He did not sin.
> -- Crush
> -----Original Message-----
> From: Dan'l Danehy-Oakes [mailto:ddanehy@siebel.com]
> Sent: Tuesday, June 11, 2002 11:02 AM
> To: 'urth@urth.net'
> Subject: (urth) The Saga of the Urth Mailing List: An Excerpt
> A final correction    to the "facts" used by Crush:
> > But in my heart of hearts I believe Wolfe concocted this
> > explanation to rescue himself from having to constantly justify
> > theologically everything in the BOTNS. I DO recall that he
> > denied Severian is Christ. He said he was a "Christ figure", but
> > that's merely a literary term.
> Actually, he went a step further than your memory, Crush -- he
> actually denies that Severian, or any of his protagonists, are
> "Christ figures," and insists that they are rather "Christian
> figures." I believe that the distinction is made fairly clearly
> in the interview Wolfe gave to James Jordan, to which a link was
> posted in this group within the last day or so.
> --Blattid
> -- 


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